The Mostly Real Estate Podcast, with Declan Spring

#58 Felicia Mares-Villa - Social Media Evolution, Career Growth, and AI Everything

• Declan Spring

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What makes the difference between surviving and thriving in today's real estate landscape? Felicia Mares-Villa has figured it out, scaling the team she co-founded to eight agents in just one year while mastering the ever-shifting world of social media marketing.

In this conversation brimming with actionable insights, Felicia reveals how Instagram's algorithm has fundamentally changed—it's no longer about follower counts but whether your content gets saved and shared. She explains why TikTok's superior geo-tagging makes it particularly valuable for real estate professionals, while also acknowledging that text-based platforms like Threads and Substack are making surprising comebacks as "people kind of want to start reading again." 

Follow Felicia on Instagram at @fel.villa

Beyond marketing tactics, we explore the deeper reasons behind Felicia's success with Arlowe Homes. Rather than aggressively recruiting, she's created a culture agents naturally gravitate toward. "A lot of people are feeling the lack of support and genuine care," she explains, noting that community has become paramount in an industry where loneliness is common. This people-first approach stands in stark contrast to the production-focused environments many agents seek to escape.

We discuss AI's role in real estate. From predictive analytics platforms that identify likely sellers to custom GPTs that provide instant answers about everything, Felicia shows how to harness these tools without fearing replacement. "AI is smart," she acknowledges, "but it's wrong"—particularly when analyzing property values.

For those struggling in challenging markets, Felicia shares multiple tools that can help agents make strategic adjustments to marketing campaigns. And perhaps most valuably, she offers wisdom on maintaining balance in a demanding industry, emphasizing that finding activities outside of real estate is essential for sustained success.

Whether you're an industry veteran or just starting out, this episode delivers the perfect blend of cutting-edge marketing tactics, team-building wisdom, and life balance strategies from someone who's trying and succeeding in mastering them all.

Felicia Mares-Villa is a licensed CA REALTOR® DRE# 02028970

Declan Spring is a licensed CA REALTOR® DRE#01398898 

Declan:

This is Declan Spring, and welcome to the Mostly Real Estate Podcast. My guest today is Felicia Mares Villa. Felicia is a whirlwind of ambition and success. I mean, she's just great. She's been on the podcast before one of my very first podcast guests, actually and the reason I wanted to interview her back then was because she was just killing it on Instagram. In particular, she's very good on social media, so we talk a lot about social media in our conversation today, but we also talk about her involvement with the Association of Realtors. She's passionate about being involved at the leadership level locally, and we also talk about Arlo Holmes, which is the team she co-founded about a year ago. They've already scaled to eight agents. It's incredible. She doesn't do anything by half measure. And then we segue into AI and there's a useful, I think, conversation around AI, and there's a useful, I think, conversation around AI and AI-related tech and that kind of thing. So I scribbled down at least three new AI-driven platforms that I'd never heard of. So listen to that. And so, just before we go to the conversation, I did want to do a quick update from episode 54.

Declan:

In May, I was chatting with Megan Meeko and we were talking about this Berkeley Ember Initiative. This ordinance, this proposed ordinance in Berkeley that would create a new kind of fire zone in the hills where people need to cut back five feet of vegetation or anything flammable from their homes and need to cut back five feet of vegetation or anything flammable from their homes. The vote was delayed a little while but finally, june 17th, there was a vote on that and the Berkeley City Council adopted these strict new rules prohibiting plants and other flammable items within five feet, and so it goes into effect. A slight tweak in some aspects of the ordinance, most notably so it goes into effect. A slight tweak in some aspects of the ordinance, most notably, would be that it's going into effect in May 2026, not January 2026.

Declan:

There's a little extra time there and I wanted to update you on that, okay, so, without further ado, here is my conversation with Felicia Maris-Villa. Felicia Marisvilla, I am so happy to have back to the podcast. Felicia Marisvilla, I really am happy to have you back here. You were one of my fairly first guests Pretty early on.

Felicia:

Yeah, Thank you so much for having me.

Declan:

Just great Watching your career take off like I knew it would and you've just been so much fun to watch. And we also chatted a lot on another podcast that was the Bridge Association of Realtors podcast.

Felicia:

Remember that Right. So I'm pretty sure this is our third, or maybe even fourth time filming together. I don't know.

Declan:

You're definitely what they call a friend of the pod.

Felicia:

Aw cute.

Declan:

And of course Dom was on here too, not too long ago.

Felicia:

Yes, my husband. He's a talker in a really good way. I'm sure his episode was amazing.

Declan:

I didn't have to do any edits at all. I mean, it was just it was flawless.

Felicia:

He is pretty flawless, although I won't tell him that I will keep that between us, okay.

Declan:

Well, I'm not going to edit it out, though, so you're stuck. It's going to be out there now. It's going to be out there, so let's talk about. Well, you know, I love chatting with you about social media. That was the first reason that we chatted, and it's a big part of what we're going to talk about today.

Felicia:

Great, I always love talking about it, love social.

Declan:

Okay, but you know other things too. You, since we initially well, when we first started talking, you weren't quite as invested in the work you were doing at Bridge, but then you went on to become president of the Association of Realtors for Oakland and Berkeley, so that was impressive. And then you have since gone on to launch your own team Now I know it's Arlo Holmes, right which is very impressive. So now you're running your own shop, more or less right.

Felicia:

Thank you, yeah, and I have my business partner, hazel. She's amazing, yeah, one of the most like caring, thoughtful, ethical realtors you will ever find.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

And we are fortunate enough now to have eight agents with us. No way.

Declan:

Yeah, how did you scale? Okay, okay, pause, pause. I want to talk about how you scale, but let's just go back a little. Some just quick questions here. When did you remind me when you got licensed again?

Felicia:

I got licensed in 2017.

Declan:

Right, that's not that long ago.

Felicia:

No.

Declan:

Right To be now. You know where you are, okay, 2017. And yes, I recall your prior broker. You got involved with real estate through. I think you were babysitting or doing childcare for his-.

Felicia:

Yeah, for his neighbor. Yeah, I was his neighbor's nanny, and then I started working at his brokerage and got licensed and then it kind of just took off from there and it's just been a complete whirlwind to look back and count the years and realize how much my life has changed because of real estate.

Declan:

Yeah, I mean it's amazing, your former broker he was also a big advocate for realtors, taking the step of being involved with the association right, and he kind of pointed you in that direction?

Felicia:

Yes, he pointed me in that direction. And then I just drank the Kool-Aid and never stopped. And so now I continue to volunteer here and there for Bridge the local association, but also on the state and national levels.

Declan:

And so your social media, which is so much fun and you know people should be following you. Thank you, it's a lot of fun to watch you and, of course, your husband now this is you know, yeah, and he's gotten a lot more into it since we.

Felicia:

And, of course, your husband now this is, you know, the tag team yeah, and he's gotten a lot more into it since we, like, when we originally got married, I was definitely the leader, I would say, of the family in terms of social media, yeah, and constantly posting and sharing. And I don't know if you've looked at his Instagram lately, but he's kind of an olive oil influencer now. Yes, lately, but he's kind of an olive oil influencer now. He has like a ridiculous following and his videos, some of them, have gone viral and it's just been really cool to see like his passion for social media kind of take off and you know, I've always had a love for it, so it's fun now that we kind of share that.

Declan:

Now that you share it, but it's kind of interesting, so I had Rachel Melby on here. Oh gosh she is just I did listen to that episode and we were talking about social media and finding your voice, and so Dom is a perfect case in point, right? Because, as a loan officer, he wasn't terribly inspired to produce content, you know, on social media. You know.

Felicia:

Well, it's not that interesting, Let me. Let me post about something I actually like and then you know, people will naturally follow it if they're interested in that thing. And it's a very specific, small niche. There's not a lot of like all of oil influencers in the world. So if you're listening and you have some really random thing that you're passionate about, if you feel like sharing it, like that might be your ticket to like finding those people who care about the same thing you do.

Declan:

Yeah, because you know some people just like you're somebody. When we first spoke I said you just kind of live your life like a movie. Um, you just document.

Felicia:

Yeah, and sometimes I forget that ever that people are watching, um, and, and sometimes I do embarrassing things or, you know, share something that I forgot like maybe isn't the best to share with every single person.

Declan:

That can happen weirdly on social media.

Felicia:

It happens yeah.

Declan:

But you're just comfortable with the medium. Yes, and as you were, just I don't know, you could have been doing almost anything and social media would have been part of it, like you were just comfortable in that space.

Felicia:

I think so. I think if I would have you know, continued in my nanny career prior to getting into real estate, I probably would have been posting like child care tips and here's how, what you should be doing with your kids. And if you're a nanny, here are some tips for communicating with the parents or, you know, I probably would have been doing something in that field for communicating with the parents, or, you know, I probably would have been doing something in that field.

Felicia:

So yeah, I think you're right. I think, no matter where I would have ended up, I probably would have fallen into the social media space.

Declan:

Whereas Dom, you know he's, he's, he's passionate about his cooking, his olive oil and and his Italian heritage and all of that stuff so meaningful, and so he's managed to bring some passion into his social media, but it's from this specific thing, Whereas you're just, you were just social media.

Declan:

You did your life's a movie right, but this is the struggle for people, you know. You get involved, like in real estate, and you were told you must produce content and now you're the content, but it just you were never interested in it and now you have to do it for the and it just doesn't work. It's a slog and you know, like. So Rachel and I were talking about how can you overcome that, or maybe you just let it go and I'm just not going to be involved in that I'm totally cool with people just saying like, that's not for me, I'm not going to do it, I'm not going to fake, do it, you know, like, if you're, if you're not going to do something well, why are you doing it?

Felicia:

That's how I feel, like. That's why I don't dabble in a bunch of different types of like, differently generating opportunities, like, because if I'm not going to enjoy it and if I'm not going to do it well, like there's really no point of me doing it. Um, so there's, there's plenty of realtors who are mega, mega successful, who don't even have social media, so you don't need to do it, but if you have any interest at all, it is a really great space and it does get more comfortable over time.

Declan:

But it should make you happy.

Felicia:

We deserve to be happy in our business practices and what we're doing day in and day out. And I think that's for me and for, like my business partner and what we talk to our agents about, a lot of it has to do with, like, finding some sort of balance in this industry, where it feels very difficult to do that.

Declan:

Right.

Felicia:

And, most importantly, finding happiness in this industry.

Declan:

Right, right and social media in general has caused anxiety and depression among the population the last 10 years. Yeah, and I think that's because you know the screen is always showing you something that you could be doing better or you know, and it's just this terribly.

Felicia:

You know Especially in this market right now I think, yeah, people could really be having the comparison factor, right, like, ooh, the market is this way, but these agents are still killing it. What am I doing wrong? Right, it's hard not to look inwards when you're seeing that on social. So yeah.

Felicia:

I think it's perfectly healthy to delete the apps or to take a break from it if that's how you're feeling, but also to keep perspective that most people are not posting their most embarrassing things on the internet, or their failures on the internet, or sharing what went wrong in an appointment or any of those things. Most people are showing their best selves online. So just keep that into perspective as you're taking in other people's content, that it's a curated view of their life. It's not an accurate view of their life.

Declan:

Exactly right, exactly right, which is why I post so randomly, because I'm waiting for these good things to come.

Felicia:

You're like man. It's been a while since something good happened, right, if I haven't posted for a week or two.

Declan:

you're like, give me a call, Something's wrong. Something's not going well, but you built. So you. This is a cool thing, though, and I, you know, I see it here's how my lens sees things is is on your social media. You've built community, right. This is kind of like a community of people that you've, you know you're followers, in other words, right.

Felicia:

Sure.

Declan:

So it's a community of people and you were active on social media and then you got involved with the Association of Realtors. Right and now correct me if I'm wrong, because these are just assumptions I make you know as we go along through life, but it looked to me like it gave you this unique ability to build a community. You know kind of across the country, of all, because you did a lot of travel around.

Felicia:

I am very impressed that you're able to spot that.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

Because that is so true and it's one of the biggest personal business benefits that I've had with the opportunity that I've had with traveling and representing the real estate associations and representing, like our area right Is that I get to connect with realtors in other markets and over the last, I would say, two years the majority of my business is coming from realtors in other places, and so I do a lot of referral-based business, whether it's, of course, with my past clients and returning clients, but a lot of that is just realtors and other areas that I've gained these relationships with, and maybe I've only met them one time at a conference sometime, but we followed each other on social media and now we've stayed connected all these years.

Declan:

And.

Felicia:

I feel like I know them and they feel like they know me and they can trust that when they send a client my way, I'm going to handle that with respect and treat that client well and ultimately result in them getting a portion of the commission as well.

Declan:

Yeah, yeah, so there's a physical community behind. You know your followers are actually a specific. You know they're a blend of all these great people you've met, networking throughout the country in real time, actually flying on planes and going to doing the things, all the things, advocating and doing all the things that people do when they're involved you know, or at the organizational level, of being a realtor.

Declan:

So thank you for all the work you do there, by the way, and you were a great president and you know, enjoyed your presidency and you know I'm just amazed that you continue to do the work that you do for, for the association, while trying to grow a team and, and you know you're- barely into your career.

Felicia:

I mean it definitely. I benefit from it in a lot of different ways, not only the relationships that I've been able to build um, but also, you know, in in learning what's going on in the industry and keeping my finger on the pole. So I think, a person in my position, it's very, very important for them to understand day in and day out, like, what the changes are, what's coming down the pipeline, um, what we can expect to see in the future, um. And so you know, I'm I'm hopefully bringing that back to my agents and bringing some of that value to them so that they're not completely shocked when one of the big industry changes comes down the line, which we've been seeing a lot of.

Declan:

So yeah, yeah, well, I wonder if we can dig in on some of that. But we'll get. Well, let's get back to your social media. So I had a few specific questions because you know, one of the problems, of course, with social media is that you know it changes and you can get comfortable and then it changes Like, for example, like these photos. I loved Instagram back 10 years ago because I'm a photographer and I love taking my pictures and you know people love them. And then everything went to reels and, like my social, my interests fell apart. Then I just was a little yeah, yeah, I kind of missed those days too.

Felicia:

Actually like um, but now what I've realized is like it's true that the algorithm favors video, um, but you know, we don't see as much photos on instagram anymore and so if you sprinkle in a photo every once in a while in between all of the reels, it does okay. It's not the worst, like it's okay to post a photo every once in a while. And I think people actually enjoy seeing a different type of medium on there, because it is so.

Felicia:

We get so locked into the reels that I think sometimes our brain kind of needs a break from it, and so when you see a photo on your feed, it does kind of make you stop a little bit and take a look at it. So it's not horrible to post photos, but just know that you probably won't gain too much of a following if you're only posting photos.

Declan:

Right. So you built your strong following over the years. You know you built it now, of course, you know I've described how part of the building of your following was born out of this, like involvement with the association realtors and all that. But what other ways did you build a following?

Felicia:

Definitely with my past clients and their friends, right, like if I'm posting a lot and building those, deepening those relationships. Sometimes you know how it is when you meet a client. You work with them in such a short period sometimes and you're like, oh, that was like really fast. I actually really enjoyed spending time with you. Um, so I always want to continue those relationships afterwards and people ask me, like, what is your followup with your past clients Right? Like, what do you do afterwards to like build this community? And it's like if I'm constantly showing up on their feed, they're going to feel like we have a close community bond, even if I haven't seen them in six months. Um, so I think staying on top of that many people it's easier to do in this space.

Declan:

Okay, okay, that's great If they're on Instagram.

Felicia:

Yeah, you know, yeah, and most of my clients are right, cause it's. I mean, you attract people who are similar to you, right, and so, um, a lot of my clients are around my age, maybe 10 years older, um, and so they tend to be on Instagram. Now, where I'm really failing is I'm horrible at Facebook.

Declan:

Okay.

Felicia:

And I will tell you, most of the homeowners are on Facebook, right, and so that's the generation that loves Facebook. They love posting on it Right, and, unfortunately, they're the ones who own all the real estate.

Declan:

That's true.

Felicia:

So if you can get really good at Facebook, I still think that's a really great place to show up.

Declan:

Yes.

Felicia:

And you know Facebook has so many different groups you can get into. But I mean essentially, when you post on Instagram, now it's on Facebook. Yes, so that's as much as I do with Facebook is. Everything is just flowing through Instagram to Facebook. Um, but I think if you also show up individually on Facebook and pay a little bit more attention there, and interact with other people right Comment on their posts, share their posts. That's going to be a better outcome than just linking your Instagram and posting directly from there.

Declan:

Okay, Okay Now, so is TikTok in your thing at all? Because I was amazed, Rachel said a couple of weeks ago when we chatted. She was like yeah, TikTok is big for real estate, TikTok's huge for real estate. I thought it was gone Really. I mean I knew it was gone for a day.

Felicia:

Yeah, and then everybody freaked out, but I thought the fear of it going away meant that it it would just never really be what it was. But then I had this revelation I mean people constantly have the fear that it's going to go away, right? So why pour so much time and effort?

Declan:

and energy into it when it might just be gone.

Felicia:

That's what. I thought was happening, but a lot of people who post on TikTok also use that content on Instagram and they're building the content specifically for TikTok and then just reusing that for Instagram. And so it doesn't feel like that much more of a waste of time or that much more to add on.

Declan:

Right.

Felicia:

Personally, I'm not on TikTok. The TikTok that I do is Dom. My husband will send me videos on TikTok, but I don't open them on my phone. He shows them to me on his phone. Oh, okay, so we watch together on his phone because he has a really solid algorithm already built out with really funny stuff okay um, but yes, there are a lot of realtors on tiktok and they do very well specifically with doing home tours um and yeah, I know an agent who gets income from tiktok because he's a part of the creator fund and they like he gets a certain amount of money every month for posting.

Declan:

If you described like before. I think it's very accurate that you know you can identify somebody's, you know what generation somebody's in Sometimes. Basically, we talked about this years ago too.

Felicia:

Yes.

Declan:

With an email address SPC Global. Yeah, ok, we all know Right With an email address spcglobalnet. Yeah, yeah, okay, we all know right AOL, but it's true, right With social media as well.

Felicia:

You correctly, you know, yes, and now, honestly, I feel like TikTok has bled into all of the generations, really. Yeah, like my mom recently sent me like an AI AI generated something that she made on TikTok and I was like what? I didn't even know. She knew how to like download this app, you know, and here she is. So I think it's one of the platforms that has just gained the biggest amount of traction, but I will say that one of the things that keeps me from going on there is that I know that the algorithm is a lot more. You have to be a lot more intentional about it, you have to post a lot more often.

Felicia:

You have to be on top of it a lot more.

Declan:

Okay.

Felicia:

So for me, if I'm, like we said before, if I'm, if I'm not going to be good at something, I just don't do it, right. Cause you know I I have to be good Like, so, um, I should be on TikTok but unfortunately I'm not. But I do think it's a really smart place for realtors to show up. And one specific thing that TikTok's really good about it's better than Instagram in this sense which makes a lot of sense for our business is their geo-tagging.

Felicia:

So, you can. You know, on Instagram you can tag your location. Tiktok is really good about showing your content to other people who are close to your location which in our business, which is very location based. That's really important.

Declan:

That is important. Oh, okay, this is, this is helpful.

Felicia:

So, if you're doing like you know favorite coffee shops in Oakland and you like are showing three different coffee shops and showing background footage or whatever, and it's you talking about why you love it or whatever it is, and you tag those. You tag where you're located.

Felicia:

They're going to show it to a lot more people in that area and you're going to get a lot more people commenting and you know, okay, clicking and sharing and re-watching, which are all parts of how you're going to get more attention on the app. You're going to talk yourself back into. I'm gonna I know, when I leave this room I'm gonna be to be like I'm getting back on TikTok.

Felicia:

It has been on my mind, but you know you have to be ready for it, like I feel like I need to go into it with a little bit of intention and making sure that I am going to be showing up there in a way that feels good and manageable.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

You know it can be very time consuming.

Declan:

So Right, yeah, yeah. It's a huge investment of time, which is why, to your point, you want to be good at it.

Felicia:

Yeah, right, yeah, because don't invest your time and then you know.

Declan:

Yes, because there's a lot of that in real estate. There's a lot of FOMO in like marketing tools.

Felicia:

Right, like you just dabble left and right and there's so many people coming at us all the time like purchase my product and try out this new tool and yeah, I just want to talk about growth.

Declan:

Like you know, gathering followers.

Felicia:

I, you know, years ago that was really a thing. People were like it was so important, and now people don't care. I don't think.

Declan:

I don't care, I don't hear it getting talked about so much.

Felicia:

Yeah, I mean, I think it's more about how the followers that you do have are showing up for you right. Like are they actually watching your content? Are they interacting with it? Are they sharing it with their friends? Are they commenting? I think those things are way more important, even for the algorithm. Um yes, it's true that, like, once you get to a certain level of followers, it's easier to get more, because people are more likely to follow an account if they have a lot of followers Cause they feel like that person is seeking followers, versus if you only have like a hundred followers.

Felicia:

Somebody might feel like, ah, is this person really like that might be weird, like I'm coming into their personal space you know Right, they're just a family and friends. Yeah, yeah, exactly, um, which is totally fine, but for me, like you know, I don't. I wouldn't consider myself having a lot of followers. I don't know how many I have. Maybe it's like five or 6,000. It's not like a crazy amount.

Declan:

Right.

Felicia:

But I know that those people that are there want to be there and that we have some sort of relationship right, even if it's just an online one, and so, yeah, I agree with you. An online one, and so, yeah, I agree with you.

Declan:

I think that's not very important anymore.

Felicia:

Okay, cause it's interesting Cause you don't need to do business with, like you know, 50,000 people. You only need.

Declan:

Yeah. Yeah, I mean not for this business, maybe that's for some other thing. If you're selling online, or social media platform. Right Cause, rachel said something similar as well. She's like she's happy. She's like you know she's hit maybe a limit because she's it's geographical for her she's El Cerrito.

Felicia:

Right, and she's so geographical and she's so specific and she found that niche and does it really really well and that's going to make her followers that have followed her for that exact reason they're going to be very happy with the fact that they still follow her Right for that exact reason.

Declan:

They're going to be very happy with the fact that they still follow her Right and they're going to stick around, and that's important too. Yeah, cause she's offering this specific thing Right and so, yeah, so the growth thing is not and it also is like you know.

Felicia:

You were asking about algorithm updates. This also relates to that, because the algorithm itself on Instagram cares less now about like whether or not somebody commented on your post or you know how many followers you have or how many views the video has. It's going to care a lot more about whether that video has been shared with anybody or saved. Do you ever use Instagram? Saves Very rarely.

Felicia:

So I use this like very well, where I have like buckets of like folders, essentially within Instagram, and it'll be like these are things that I want to film by myself and I'll save it in that folder. And it'll be like these are things that I want to film with my agents and I save it in the agent folder. Here's things that I want to post with Dominic and I put it in that folder, even though he'll never do content with me because he likes to do solo content.

Declan:

No, I mean you do the vegetables. Yeah, we do the vegetables Sunday.

Felicia:

So when you get people to save your content, if it's something they either want to come back to or they want to remake your content in some way. They will save it in their folder and that gives your content a boost in the algorithm.

Declan:

I see, because it's valuable content. It's valuable content.

Felicia:

So that's why the, the and the reason why I think the algorithm focuses on that way is because they're seeking quality right over quantity. It's no longer like you need to post five times a day and you need to have this amount of followers and make sure you you get so many people to comment. Now it's more about are people lingering on your video? Are they re-watching your video? Are you holding their attention throughout the entire video?

Declan:

Are they?

Felicia:

saving it and coming back to it and watching it again. Are they sending it to? I don't know if you're in any group chats in Instagram, but I have a couple of friend groups where it'll be like me. I have one with like me and my best friends and we send each other videos. I have one with me and my best friends and we send each other videos.

Felicia:

So if I know it's something that relates to one of my friends and I send it to her. That's going to help that video's ability to reach new audiences. So you want to film things that people are going to want to share with other people that they know and that's going to help your video get more traction. Thank you for explaining all of that. I hope I did a clear explanation of that. I think that's very clear.

Declan:

Yeah, I think that's very clear. You brought up something interesting too, though group chats. I have heard that in recent months, or maybe the past year, like group chats have kind of broken out as being like a thing unto themselves. Like there are group chats out there that people like want to get invited to like, like, like the most you know, like like the greatest party of all time. You want to into that.

Felicia:

Yes, that is true, I, it is true, I. I recently got into one of these group chats that I really wanted to get into, and it's a group of realtors who just talk about realtor stuff.

Felicia:

Right, you know so I of realtors who just talk about realtor stuff right you know, so I so getting invited by somebody in the group chat, like, oh, you're not a part of this yet, let me invite you Right, like that kind of thing is. And if you can create that for people, like, if you're passionate about anything, just pick something you really like. Um, you're big on coffee. You know, you're really big on coffee, so you want to share, like, oh, I went to this coffee shop or whatever. You find other people who like that same?

Felicia:

thing and you make a group chat about it and then you, you know, you get them to spread the word. And then I do feel like and I think we talked about this the last time we met but DMs are so important the direct messages, right, and this group chat thing is a part of that. Right Now we're talking about a community in DMs, not just one-off conversations. How are you doing? But here's something that we're all passionate about and want to talk about.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

Let's do that in the group chat.

Declan:

Yes, so if you're listening and you're not in a group chat, don't worry, but you could probably start your own.

Felicia:

Start one, yeah, I mean it's hard to find them because it's not like you search for a group chat in a public setting and you request to join, like that's how Facebook groups work.

Declan:

You can go on.

Felicia:

Facebook and search any topic you want and find a group you can't do that.

Declan:

This is why the group chats have gotten to be a thing More exclusive.

Felicia:

Yes, because you need an invite yeah, you need to know, someone's got to tell you about it, right? So it's a little, yeah, it's a little hard but yeah, so so that's kind of interesting.

Declan:

so how do you, um, yeah, how do you like, how do you, uh, continue to maintain, you know, as the algorithm changes over the last and I'm sure it's changed a little in the last few years like, more of an emphasis on reels and stories are, you know, a big deal? How do you, how do you maintain, or how do you keep going with your, just your, your social media game, with these, like, do you find that there's just way too much time editing videos now?

Felicia:

or like, oh gosh, editing is the bane of my existence.

Declan:

I feel, like.

Felicia:

It's why I haven't been posting as regularly anymore, because I'm just getting tired of editing. Um, and you know, instagram actually came out with its own editing app.

Declan:

I don't know if you've tried it.

Felicia:

It's called edits.

Declan:

Yeah, I think I did.

Felicia:

I tried it one afternoon and it's a version of CapCut which CapCut is like the biggest video editing platform out there A lot of.

Felicia:

TikTok users use CapCut to edit their videos. So of course Instagram needed to compete. So they came out with edits and I, literally yesterday, edited a video on edits and now it's like frozen and I can't export it and I can't download it. And now I'm just like, well, I guess I'm never going to post that video because I don't feel like redoing the whole thing in a different platform. So personally can't recommend. Oh my gosh.

Felicia:

But I know that it's new still and they're still working out kinks in it, so it's probably something that's going to get better over time. Okay, but you asked about staying on top of all of these changes. There's a couple of like. I'll follow a couple of people on Instagram. I try not to like. Bog down my feed with like. Here's what you need to be posting on Instagram, right?

Felicia:

But there are creators who their entire platform is just to teach you about Instagram or just to teach you about Tik TOK, like that's their entire profile and what they post about. So finding a couple of those people and following them and then when they post, it comes up on your feed and you don't have to go out and seek the information. It's showing up in your feed, where you're already at.

Declan:

Um and so that's how I stay up on the times that there you go.

Felicia:

There's a little hack for you. Another little hack. You know who's really good at researching these things and explaining it to you? Our very good friend, chat GBT is really good at researching these things, no, and explaining it to you, who Our very good friend, chatgbt, yes, is so good at these things? Because they also, you know, they can pull current data now and they can send you links for where you could see more information about that. So you could literally go into ChatGBT and say like, hey, any new updates with the algorithm on Instagram?

Declan:

Right. Well, this is the thing about. Ai is like you can, and I talk to people who are not using AI and the first thing I try and explain to them is you don't need it, will just talk to it, you don't need to know what to do. Yes.

Felicia:

Like you can even ask it what should I ask you?

Declan:

Right, Because this is people's problem and fear around new technology. Usually it's why my mother thought I was a wizard, because I could use a VCR, right, because that was you know a new thing, and she was already you know an adult and it was fangled.

Felicia:

But yeah, but now we have new technology and this technology will teach you how to use it right. And so one trick, I guess, to using ChatGPT with social media specifically is going in there and explaining who you are, right, like what your vibe is, like. What I'll do is I'll just link our website so it can read all about us, right, it knows about me, it knows about the agents, it knows about the company, it knows everything. So and then I say, now that you know us, tell me what else you need to know to curate some really good content for us, right? And then it'll ask you questions. It can ask you things, right. So it'll say, like what kind of things do you care about? What is your niche? What is your typical client? What kind of client.

Felicia:

Would you prefer to have what's your average price point Like it could ask you questions that it needs to know in order to curate the content it wants to give you. And then from there it can help you kind of put these things together first.

Declan:

So do you have a separate uh, you know feed for Arlo homes? You have a, you know, social media on Instagram. Yes, yeah, and now I have one for the home factor, but I I rarely if, like, I don't use it. It's not your fault.

Felicia:

So I also don't really use our Arlo Holmes Instagram, which is really bad. But the reason why is because we hired a content company who they help us film, edit and post all of our content on there.

Declan:

Okay.

Felicia:

And so you know it looks very professional. If you go on there on Arlo Holmes on Instagram, you'll see like our agents doing video. Every agent has videos on there. We always do when they join the company. We do an introduction, you know video. And then we do like a fun one, you know like that's like a trending sound one or whatever. And then we have like educational videos on there that are professionally filmed and edited.

Felicia:

So that way I don't have to do it, cause if it was up to me, we just like wouldn't have as much content, right? Cause I'm only one per I can't do everything?

Declan:

No, of course not, and you do the off the cuff kind of. That's my style, my style is like, more like let me post more on stories so I can the cuff. Yes, I don't want to do a bunch of editing and make it beautiful, I just want to like talk to my people. Yes, but they so. But so I bet, though, because the arlo holmes instagram channel whatever we call these things handle it's.

Felicia:

It's newer I bet you have been watching growth there. Yes, yeah, right, because I mean it's harder. I will say it's harder to gain traction as a company. Like people don't follow companies as much as they follow people. People want to follow people. People want to follow like, maybe brands, but like it's got to be a recognizable brand right. So in the beginning, of course, it's like my mom right, my sister who's going?

Felicia:

to follow me and comment on all my stuff, and then now it's been growing a little bit, as, of course, as we've gotten agents to like, then their friends and family and past clients start following, and so we're gaining traction there. I think what we do need to get better at on Arlo Holmes Instagram is posting some more of the off the cuff stuff, because that content is very relatable.

Felicia:

It's a little bit more comfortable for people. People don't love to like always see like a very curated feed. Sometimes they just want to see, like, what's really going on.

Declan:

Yeah, like you, you probably don't have several stories a day for Arla homes.

Felicia:

No, no and when we do, it's usually like us marketing a property or sharing something that one of our agents posted because we want to support them, um, but yeah, so we might have like two or three story posts a day, if even. Um, but what I would love to do is show my face on there a little bit more and maybe to have the agents post a little bit more off the cuff.

Felicia:

But, we're right now. We're working on getting them comfortable in front of the camera. That's step one and they're getting great, so they're really improving there. Get them comfortable in front of the camera and then force them to do some of the more, like you know, less structured things.

Declan:

Yeah, yeah, got it. Why don't we give a shout out to whoever is doing the video stuff for?

Felicia:

you. Yes, their name is arrows. They are a digital media company and the owners are amazing. Our boy, josh, films all of our content for us and he has been with us since the day that we launched and he is like our secret, like third business partner, like him and chat GPT are like our other business partners, right, um, but he is just the most lovely, sweet, awesome person and their team is great and they know who we are.

Declan:

Right.

Felicia:

So it helps Um, and he's really good at getting people comfortable in front of the camera, so we really appreciate that cool, cool, okay, so people can people can find them.

Declan:

Yeah, uh, now let's see, I I had another question in here that I wrote down and I thought it might be useful. Oh yeah, this was the last one on social media right now, because you've you've given away, um, a lot of great stuff here and I really appreciate it. There's a lot of little stuff here and I really appreciate it. There's a lot of little nuggets in there, but okay. So my final question on the social media was what advice would you give agents just starting out on Instagram today, versus, like, because you started out a long time ago it was different. But now if somebody, yeah, how do you start on social media today? Would you just go straight to TikTok?

Felicia:

Honestly, I would Don't be like me. Don't avoid TikTok just because you're intimidated. Go on TikTok. I do feel like that is the best platform to be showing up on right now, if you have it in you. Youtube has more streams than Netflix. Like YouTube is a bigger, like people watch YouTube more than they watch Netflix, which is crazy, because I watch a lot of Netflix.

Felicia:

You know, I'm not a big YouTuber, but if you have long form video that you want to do, that's definitely the place to show up. It's still super worth it, even though it's very competitive. But I would say, getting comfortable on TikTok as early as possible, because that content that you would make for TikTok is also usable for Instagram and on YouTube shorts. So YouTube has, like you know, the short form video that you can post as well.

Felicia:

So, I feel like it's easier if you post on TikTok first and then use that content on the other platforms, versus the other way around. So if you're looking for one platform to get comfortable on, that's the one that I would say to do. However, it's a bigger barrier to entry right, because not everybody's comfortable on that, and at least on Instagram you can still post photos. And you know it's a little bit more of the social media that we're used to, so don't get too bogged down with all the details, just start.

Felicia:

Just start, just start, don't get in your head about it. I would say look into kind of maximizing your profile, like your name, your location, what you do, who should be following you and put yourself in the followers' shoes. And if they clicked on your account and they read your bio, is there anything in there that would make them want to follow you? What are you going to be posting about so that people know? This is somebody I want to follow because they're going to be posting about this thing that I really care about.

Felicia:

And then you know what's interesting. While we're on the topic of platforms, there are a lot of Okay. So X Twitter totally went downhill once Elon Musk got his hands on it.

Declan:

Yeah, he like totally killed Twitter. No, it's a disgusting mess, it was just horrible yeah, but also hilarious, because that's what he gets. I can't go on there because I don't. I can't even go on there.

Felicia:

Oh, if.

Declan:

I go on there. It's a cesspool of violence and weirdness.

Felicia:

It's a horrible platform now you don't want to be on there, don't even get a I wouldn't.

Declan:

I gave up my, my whole.

Felicia:

But what's interesting is that there's going to be a lot of competing platforms that have a similar type of feel, right like there is a demand for platforms that are word-based right so if you're not a video editor, you you don't like posting photos, you're not into that kind of thing. There are other platforms that I think you could really really benefit from being on as a realtor that are text-based. If you're really good with your words, there's.

Declan:

Threads and Blue Sky Threads yes.

Felicia:

Threads is an Instagram version of X that they wanted to create to, of course, compete with X, and that's actually doing pretty well. I know a lot of people who are very active on there and you can still post the occasional photo or whatever.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

Um, but I think that's a really good place to be, and most people who are on Instagram a lot of them are on threads.

Declan:

So it's a big audience already. Yeah.

Felicia:

Right, Um. And then another one that's getting very popular is sub stack.

Declan:

Yes, right Like that blog-based platform.

Felicia:

We're going backwards here. People, People kind of want to start reading again.

Declan:

I like long form. I do podcasts and I do Substack. It's my happy place.

Felicia:

I'm not sure how much of a following, but I don't care, I'm just happy it's where I'm comfortable, and I love that there's so many different platforms where you can find happiness in whatever your type of media is right. And you can just kind of focus on that.

Declan:

Yes, there's infinite, there's seemingly endless. You know communication channels nowadays. It's part of the problem and it's part of the joy.

Felicia:

Right. And one of the things that I'm keeping my eyes on is OpenAI, who is the leaders of ChatGPT? They are supposedly creating their own social media platform. Oh, so it's probably coming down the pipeline. It's supposed to be similar to X but I'm assuming that there's going to be some AI component to that social media platform, cause that's what they do they're open AI, um, so that'll be really interesting to see when that comes out, I'll play with it.

Felicia:

You know I always like any platform that comes out. I'm going to take a look at it and see if it's for me or not.

Declan:

Sure, that one I'll certainly take a look at yeah.

Felicia:

Although I'm not very interested in seeing a bunch of AI content. So if it is like AI generated stuff, if you have to use that in your content, go ahead. But I'm telling you people don't like it, it's not that great right.

Declan:

People want to see real life still yeah, we're not there yet yeah, we're not there yet. Yeah, it'll get to a point where it mimics real life so well that it'll be flawless. I mean, look how far it's coming.

Felicia:

Sometimes it's scary, yeah, yeah, really scary yeah, there's like videos on tiktok where it'll show you like a real photo and then an ai photo and it's like, guess which one is ai?

Felicia:

it's so hard like it's scary how hard it is yeah so we also need, like, maybe some legislation coming down the pipeline that protects people from that, because I could see a lot of people getting convinced to buy certain things if things are ai generated, and I don't- see, I don't think the current administration has any interest in guardrails on any of this stuff.

Declan:

Yeah, that's part of that's part of what this current administration is they're like more money.

Felicia:

that's good. Who cares? Yeah, yeah absolutely.

Declan:

I think the guardrails came off. Yeah, you know a few years ago, and certainly with this administration. This administration forget it, guardrails forget it. You're asking the wrong question. Now it's a whole different thing where you know how social media was just a giant experiment and finally, with people like jonathan hate writing books and saying, you know, yeah, that was a, that was a wild experiment, but you know, we got some data. Now it wasn't good, especially for teenage girls, for example.

Felicia:

Right, let's keep our kids off of there, please.

Declan:

Unfortunately, the way it looks to me right now is we're going to do the same thing over with AI. We're about to launch into a five to 10 year period of no guardrails and just massive like let's just throw it out there all the time.

Felicia:

Yeah, until we see the damage that is done and then hopefully at some point we'll have a decent leadership who will protect us from that.

Declan:

Yes, if we're not.

Felicia:

I think that's the least of our worries at this point. We have a lot going on that we need to probably fix before we.

Declan:

Well, it's part of it. It's part of it, though it's all linked together, so I like this info about this. I didn't know OpenAI was coming up with their own thing.

Felicia:

They're being very secretive about it, but supposedly it's going to be similar to.

Declan:

X.

Felicia:

I mean they were secretive about ChatGPT, and then one day, there it was, and they don't need to really tease much, because when they come out with something, we're all going to jump on it.

Declan:

That's right. That's right, so okay, well, listen, God, that's so interesting I did want to ask you about, so I happen to be somebody who watches a lot of YouTube. Do you pay for ad-free YouTube?

Felicia:

I don't, but I don't watch YouTube.

Declan:

Okay, because it changed my life when I took the ads out of.

Felicia:

YouTube you know, I would be curious if Dominic does, because he loves YouTube. He watches it for like cooking videos and biking videos.

Declan:

Yes.

Felicia:

So I'm curious if he pays for it. But he doesn't like doing subscription stuff so I doubt he does. But it's worth it Okay.

Declan:

It's not that expensive. It's 20 bucks a month, okay, and it is. It's just amazing, like it's literally. For me it was like a life-changing pleasure, right Because-.

Felicia:

That is a luxury that I am so glad that you partook in, because-.

Declan:

Well, you know, honestly, I look at everything. I'm like do I really need to spend this money out on coffee and make more coffee at home and watch my YouTube?

Felicia:

Hey, yeah, that's fine. It's working out well for me.

Declan:

It's a good trade off, but there's the little, little simple pleasures. Like you, you probably don't remember because, but I remember the eighties and we would watch MTV and it was endless videos for hours and hours.

Felicia:

Yeah.

Declan:

And then that disappeared. What guess what? It's back and if you pay out for YouTube, you can be right back in the eighties watching MTV again. That's one of my little joys. But there's such great people to follow Like. There's all these people across Europe who are renovating old homes and chateaus and I just you know they become like people on Instagram. They become your friends.

Felicia:

Yeah, you know them, you know their personalities.

Declan:

You follow their lives.

Felicia:

You get excited for them when they get pregnant or they buy a new house or they Well, the wonderful thing about renovating these?

Declan:

you know, historic or ancient properties is. You know you're waiting for next week for the? You know the master bedroom, or what we call it nowadays primary bedroom. You know all that kind of stuff.

Felicia:

It's like TV. It's like TV and it's why, like YouTube has more people watching it than they do Netflix. Right, like it's, because it's TV.

Declan:

It's TV, yeah, and you can even rent movies now, so you don't need anything else at all. So it's amazing and I finally started paying for ChatGPT because you know what I use it for required that I really, really it was just ridiculous that I wasn't paying the $20 a month, so I discontinued paying, I think.

Felicia:

I was paying like 20. Okay, so when did you make that switch recently?

Declan:

Yeah, like just in the last two weeks. So.

Felicia:

I started paying for chat chat JPT right away, like as soon as it came out, and they came out with the paid version. I'm like I'm getting that Cause I already know I'm going to be in this, okay. So I would love to hear from you what are the differences that you've noticed from the non-paid to the paid?

Declan:

Well, the simple thing is, I would every day, you know, I could ask maybe three or four questions, oh you?

Felicia:

reach a limit, you reach a limit. Oh yeah, I would have no way been able to last long on the limit. Yeah, I ask too many follow-up questions.

Declan:

I need yeah, no, I mean yeah, I, I couldn't. So you know, it's the end of your conversation and you have to wait for 24 hours oh yeah, I'm not doing that.

Felicia:

That's terrible yeah it's dead.

Declan:

No, you would so that. So, so I'm, I'm right now congratulations on paid subscriptions.

Felicia:

I'm very proud of you for investing in yourself, in your business, in your happiness. I am a happier person.

Declan:

But I was paying 25 bucks a month for some video editing thing that I wasn't using, so I canceled that, started paying for ChatGPT. I'm like, okay, this is better. I love that, you know, because the video editing thing wasn't working. So. But I'm a big fan of YouTube and I'm surprised because it seems to me to be just kind of sitting there waiting. As far as East Bay Real Estate, there's nobody who's really tapped in that I'm aware of who has Into YouTube.

Felicia:

Yeah, that is so true. Yeah, and I think I wonder if it's because I mean the long-form video it's a little harder to make. It's a different shape than social media, so you would be making completely different content right Because you're using the landscape over portrait mode and there's so much competition on YouTube there's so many really good creators um that people have been doing it for decades.

Declan:

Right so it's.

Felicia:

I mean, I think they what? How long have they been around? 20 years. So yeah people are really good at it. So I think it's a kind of an intimidating space to get into, but you are so right that there's no one local who's doing it. Well, can I just make a recommendation? Yeah, you could have a camera set up right here while we're filming this podcast and release this as a podcast? Yes Video.

Declan:

I plan on doing that.

Felicia:

Do you ever watch podcast videos? I don't. A lot of people film the content and you know what? Then you can send that footage to like an editor and they can take social media clips and post it for you.

Declan:

That is the goal for 2026.

Felicia:

I love that for you, yeah.

Declan:

I'm totally going to do that, and that's why.

Felicia:

That's why it's so beautiful in here. I'm like it's set up perfectly for a video, but nobody can see us right now.

Declan:

I know they will. I wanted to do a solid year because I took most of last year off, but I wanted to do a solid year. But that's the plan. But yeah, I know I have a friend, chris brown, who I had on the podcast, who's in las vegas and you know he he decided youtube was definitely because a lot of people coming into vegas are looking to understand what's it like to live in vegas. So his whole angle was here's what it's like to live in vegas and here's all the neighborhoods, come on, everyone's welcome. And he just took off and blew up on YouTube and all his business comes through his YouTube channel.

Felicia:

That is awesome and it keeps going. Yeah, like a video you made five years ago might all of a sudden bring in a client.

Declan:

That's what he was saying. That is the beauty of.

Felicia:

YouTube, it lives forever. That's exactly what he was saying. And that's not usually what's happening with the social content that you and I put out. That's going to be good for maybe a week if we're lucky.

Declan:

Yes, right.

Felicia:

People don't usually go back that far in time, right? No one's scrolling to the beginning of my feed to click on some video.

Declan:

Right, I think the only exception and she's exceptional in many ways and I haven't had her on the podcast yet, but is Ellie Ridge. I think she's actually building content that people save and go back to.

Felicia:

Oh, I'm sure. And that goes back to the fact of like get people to save it right, like her content's so educational that people are like wait, I'm really going to need to know this information. Let me save it.

Declan:

Yes, yeah, hey, listen, let's switch gears. Okay, I want to talk about Arlo, yeah.

Felicia:

Because, as somebody, my little baby, yeah, no, it's amazing.

Declan:

So it's Well. You just impressed the socks off me, which is not unusual whenever I talk to you, which is why I'm so grateful you're on the podcast, but you scaled all. So when did you launch Arlo? Not the whole, like getting ready to launch Arlo. So you got to aid agents how, like professionally? I'm just curious because I have a small team here. Granted, I'm not out there trying to scale at all because I'm happy doing the things that I do, yeah, of course, but I don't understand how you could Well it wasn't on purpose.

Felicia:

I'll tell you that it wasn't planned. So me and my business partner Hazel, we told ourselves you know, we're just going to keep it to me, you and we had an executive assistant and we're like the three of us are going to just spend a year together before we start bringing anybody in.

Felicia:

We're going to take our time, we're not going to go out and look for people. But then people started showing up and I'm not one to turn somebody down from the party, so I'm like get your butt in here and let's do this thing, Um. But we had to be very clear with the agents who joined in the beginning. Like hey, we're just starting, Like we, we put ourselves out there, we launched the brand and then people started becoming attracted to the brand cause. It is very beautiful, Um, and I think you know we've grown very easily in Solano County, where Hazel is located.

Felicia:

And so we have a very far reach. Our agents cover anywhere from I'm in Oakland to all the way out to Napa, to all the way out to Sacramento. We have a huge range, which is really great in a market like this, because we need to know what's happening in all these different markets. Happening in all these different markets, Um. But luckily, like Hazel has such a great reputation in her market that it was very natural for people to come and say like wait, what are you doing and can I be a part of this? And when we said like we're brand new, we're just getting this worked out, People were cool with that Right, and we we brought in um, you know somebody, fairly quickly and um, and then slowly over the last year, you know not just all at once.

Felicia:

It was very like let's slowly add on when people show interest and when we meet with them and if they feel like a good fit bring them in. Um, and we have agents at all different stages. There are people who are brand brand new and there are people who are very experienced, doing more transactions than even myself, um, so it's it's a wide range, which I love. The diversity, and the diversity in locations too, is very interesting. So I think we we all learn a lot from each other.

Declan:

It's so interesting because you know, to have the capacity to not only launch a brand but then to be able to take in and have agreements with all of these people at various stages of careers, from the newer people who are probably anticipating some training yeah, to the you know, to whatever you know. The split is that the people who've you know, who are more seasoned, want, right, you know like I'm amazed you've had the capacity to do that and and aside, I know you're with Side and my team. We're nested under Keller Williams, right? I like what Keller Williams gave us to work with. That's part of the reason the Home Factor wanted to be with Keller Williams. I haven't looked into Side, but would you credit Side's model with your ability to scale the way you have?

Felicia:

Oh, absolutely. There's no way that we could do all the back end work and be face to face with our agents and teaching them and guiding them and providing the value that they came to us for Um, and so side takes care of all of the compliance and legal Um and they have multiple brokers within the state of California that our agents can go to when they want that support, and so we are the kind of the first line of defense. Come to us for anything. But if we need to get legal involved, we totally can. They're there in the back, you know, handling business for us, and so that's. That's allowed us to not get so bogged down with like okay, well, how, who's going to have our E&O insurance?

Felicia:

Where are we going to? You know who's going to be our attorneys? Who are we going to go to for questions? Like we didn't have to figure out any of that because it was all baked into the side system. And also even when it comes to technology right. They have a huge technology stack that we pay for. There's a monthly fee that goes along with that, and so you know we already had the CRM picked out that we were going to use. We have an app that we use to access transactions.

Declan:

What's the CRM? I have to know. Follow up boss. Oh, you use follow up boss. Yeah, okay, yeah.

Felicia:

And then side has its own app, the side app, which just has all the forms in it.

Felicia:

There's a chat bot in there or not even a bot, actually the chat feature that goes to a live customer service person who assists with any questions. So there's a lot of support on the back end that allows us to not only maintain our businesses but then to do the things that we said we were going to do for these agents. And you brought up a good point that, of course, agents are always at different splits, right, like depending on what your situation is. And so for those that are bringing in a ton of business themselves and you know they don't need as much handheld handholding or one-to-one attention, um, those people are at, you know, one other split. And then the folks that are brand new. Of course, we know that that that's a huge responsibility, yeah, like we have to be with our agents teaching them a lot of things, yeah, and so we're lucky that we have set up a structure where Hazel and I can do one on one, mentoring and training, and we do that ourselves, but there's also additional help from side that they can take advantage of.

Felicia:

There's other training that happens with inside. So when, for example, when a new form comes out, they do a broker training from the broker and the attorney to show hey, here's what the updates are with this form, here's how this is going to work. And then the agents feel like they're getting education they need without us having to plan to do that.

Declan:

Yes, okay. Yeah, not too dissimilar to KW. There are differences, obviously, but there's a lot of similarity there too.

Felicia:

Yeah.

Declan:

Because nobody opens. I explain this to consumers often nowadays, because consumers are unaware that these are teams at brokerages. Right, they're, you know, but nobody opens a brokerage anymore because of all the reasons you pointed out, like who can afford the tech stack, the legal, all?

Felicia:

it's just unaffordable to open a brokerage yeah, especially, I think, in the east bay. I mean, we've seen all of our small not all of them, a large majority of our small brokers, yeah, um, have to sell their brokerages right and not, and, and to keep up with the splits that are offered in our market it's not possible really to make money off of this.

Felicia:

So like we ain't making much either, right, Like this isn't a money thing where, like we're rolling in it over here because we have agents that are transacting, um, because there's very minimal amount that you can earn from this. But for me personally, it's more about ensuring, guaranteeing that the people around me are on the same page, right Like. We have similar styles, we care similarly and because we've had, we've gotten the opportunity to hand select the people that we're with, right and so there's a little bit more.

Felicia:

I wanted a little bit more control over that aspect and of the branding aspect, right, like I want to make sure that Arlo Holmes has an an outward appearance of what I would want to present from myself and that our agents align with that as well and that they're happy there. Um, so for me it was more about being happy in the business, like kind of what we touched on earlier. The happiness factor is very important, um, and less so about this is going to make me a bunch of money and I'm going to be able to just do this and retire.

Declan:

Yeah, that's, that's. That's rarely a useful, you know, way to go about doing anything.

Felicia:

It's the wrong. Yeah, that's a good point.

Declan:

Right, it's the it's. It's the wrong ambition, I mean.

Felicia:

And specifically, I think, for our industry, right Like, if your heart ain't in it and you're in it for money, you're not going to be happy because it's a roller coaster.

Declan:

It's a struggle.

Felicia:

Yeah, no, it can be very much a struggle for the majority of us.

Declan:

Yeah, so, yeah yeah. It's not like it is on TV, that's for sure.

Felicia:

No, so if what you're describing, though, in how you scaled is very similar to what Anna Belomo told me, and Anna Belomo's that side too.

Declan:

She's a side. When she started District Homes, she was just surprised people started coming to her?

Felicia:

Oh, because she's so well-respected in our area.

Declan:

Yes.

Felicia:

I mean, who wouldn't want to work closely to somebody that they respect? I guess?

Declan:

so People just showed up and were like, hey, you know. So I'm curious, when people come to you like why are they leaving where they're leaving and why do they want to join, Like that's you know.

Felicia:

That is such a great question. A lot of times it has to do with community.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

I think a lot of people right now, not just in our industry, but just people in the world, in our country, are kind of lonely. I think we all feel, especially in this industry, though it's hard because you're just doing things day in, day out by yourself. People are feeling the lack of support and genuine care. A lot of people might feel like their previous leadership had a little bit of ego right or like that their heart wasn't really in being a leader of the brokerage right.

Felicia:

So I think there's issues more in relation to them just feeling satisfied overall with like the vibes. They're just looking for good vibes. They just want to be a part of a community that they can be happy with, that they can trust, that they know people genuinely care about them and genuinely care like have each other's backs.

Declan:

Okay, right.

Felicia:

Like I have. I was actually reflecting on that this morning because over the last year a lot of our agents have gone through personal struggles like a family member passing away. You know, sure, relationships big thing, big life, changing things happening in their lives.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

And I think Hazel and myself really wanted to make it a priority to make sure we understood what our agents were going through, that they knew that we cared about them as a person, not as just a producer, right? So it's.

Declan:

I think if that's the reason why you're leaving your current brokerage, right, you're probably going to be a little bit happier right somewhere where people care about you yeah, no, and it's so essential in this business because there's a lot of demand from our clients yes and it's our job to understand them and be there for them and grit our teeth sometimes, yeah, even when you're going through things.

Felicia:

It's very difficult. You don't want to dump that on them right and then I think the other side of that is like hazel and myself are both very um innovative we are always looking to what's coming in the future.

Felicia:

You know that that's something that excites me. I I come in this room and I get excited about talking about what potentially could be coming down the line. So always looking at the future and what we should be updating within the company to make sure that we're benefiting from whatever new tools, tech platforms are coming out without bombarding the agents with too much Like.

Felicia:

we need to be the one that like kind of tests the things out okay learn how to use it and then teach them how to use it in a very simple, understandable way, in a way that they're actually going to utilize that platform and not like okay overwhelm them well, that's a perfect segue into ai, which is which we love

Declan:

which, which we love, and and and, so we're, we're gonna we're to make this the last part of our chat today, because we could just talk forever. So, yeah, let's talk about AI a little bit. You know the chat. So I was listening to another podcast that I enjoy a lot Hard Fork. I listen to it every Friday morning religiously. It's where I get my updates about the tech world and it's a local Bay Area. It's a New York Times podcast. I'll have to take a look. It's where I get my updates about the tech world and it's a local Bay Area.

Felicia:

It's a New York Times podcast, but it's I'll have to take a look.

Declan:

It's very, very good. But they talk a lot about AI and one of the callers into the show was talking about how she uses ChatGPT in parenting and that she resisted and resisted for a long time having her child ask directly. She would want to like be the medium right, so child would ask a question Mom didn't quite know Would ask chat GPT you mean when the kid's like why?

Felicia:

Why?

Declan:

But why, mommy? Yes, I love that. Then she eventually, you know, gave in and just you know in a moment of weakness. The child just was straight talking to Chachi PT. So later on mom is having a chat with the daughter about something else and the daughter is asking her a question and she doesn't know the answer to it. And the child says let's ask Chapatiti. Okay, so that's why you call it Chapatitiini, that's why I call it Chappatini. Yeah, yeah, that's why I call it Chappatini.

Felicia:

That is so cute, but it's so funny how kids can learn these platforms so easily. I mean, I know kids just soak up information. They learn everything so easily, but they know to ask Siri for like answers, right, like it's interesting, yeah, yeah, but yeah, I mean I thought you were going to say the mom uses it to like ask for parenting advice, which is one way you could use it.

Declan:

Sure People use it for all, yeah, or like, hey, I'm trying to make these.

Felicia:

you know, sometimes I help, I have it, help me make decisions right, like I'm debating these two things, like just this morning I was trying to pick a pink color, for goodness sakes, you know how difficult that is to pick a freaking pink color. Yeah, so I'm like I got this listing what pink should I use for the wall, right, like here's the vibe. And then, and then the two colors I gave it.

Declan:

It told me one was more traditional and one was more modern and I was like, cool, I know what style we're going with then have you seen that filter in the redfin app now, where you can just roll your finger across the screen and it will take the photo from the MLS and you'll say, uh, update this bathroom to you know whatever you want Modern.

Felicia:

Is it pretty good? Does it work well? I feel like any of those I've tried in the past haven't worked well, but I it's kind of good Okay.

Declan:

All right, I'll have to play with it.

Felicia:

I mean, I might just be so like I might have low expectations for those kinds of things I thought it was pretty good, all right okay yeah, because you could ask it.

Declan:

Eight different styles, cool and kind of like, kind of good. You know, a little unrealistic in the sense that like, yeah, that's going to cost you two hundred thousand dollars of course, but we're just trying to get like baseline ideas here.

Declan:

Yeah, yeah, right, because it's you know. So it basically knows where the window is, knows where the stove is, and just puts in fancier ones and you know because. But, but, so, so, so AI is coming into our lives like it's crapped in in all kinds of ways, and so I guess the big question here cause I don't keep going on forever the big question I would ask about AI is what's the disruption in the career of a realtor? Where will we? You know, because a lot of people, okay, so people are coming out of college right now, just in the past year, and all of a sudden, seemingly those entry-level jobs are just not there.

Declan:

There seems to be massive struggle in that specific scenario, just the entry-level jobs, which is a real problem Because, okay, the entry-level jobs they're finding, ai can do that work. But now you have a twofold problem. You have people not getting experience at an entry-level job that will then benefit them as they go up the ladder. The entire rung has been pulled out. Yeah, it's horrible, right, so you can't get the experience to get to rung three because it's been taken from you.

Felicia:

Yeah, I was talking to a guy recently who's really big in the tech world and he was very adamant that, even because I was like, well, what about the trades Right? Like we'll always have the trades right, like protect the trades, and a lot of people now who are getting into the job market or who are, you know, in high school or college age are going to start getting into the trades, I think, cause they think that is the protected kind of industry, We'll always need somebody to fix a toilet right Like who's going to do that?

Felicia:

But the tech people will probably tell you that robots will be doing that in the future, because who wants to fix a toilet? Right, like, who wants that work? And so there's two sides of that coin. But I think if the world is going to move in that direction, then what are we going to do? Salary-wise, right, like. That's always the question that I ask. So then, how are the humans going to make money? Right, like, if they're going to take over all of our jobs, please do it, take mine right now, but, like, pay me though, like. So that becomes then the issue, right, is how do people survive if AI is doing everybody's work? And that is really where I do think that legislation does need to come out to protect people from this, and we will probably, like you said earlier, only do that in hindsight once it's a little bit too late, unfortunately. But in terms of the real estate industry, I personally am not very concerned.

Felicia:

I think, that our clients will always need us to walk the property and see it in person. I think that they will always need the handholding that we do for them, the support, the emotional support that we give them. Um, you know, if anything, I think that stuff will become more important, um, and maybe it'll take off some of the stuff that we don't even really enjoy doing, like some of the backend stuff.

Declan:

You see, I'm not so sure. I think that that's a very it's, it's a very easy thing to sort of tell ourselves is that they'll always need the emotional support. But I'm not sure if it really holds up under scrutiny. Okay, because one of the number one, one of the number one uses of chat, gpt and AI these days is for personal therapy. So so these AI systems, they do have the capacity to touch people at their most vulnerable place and establish a relationship with them. Sure, that's being demonstrated right now.

Declan:

So if you kind of bear that in mind and then revisit the idea that people need the handholding, you know, but they're it's holding people's hands right now, yeah, so, like I mean, I do think we're kind of that's a really good point and that's very. People need the hand holding. It's holding people's hands right now.

Felicia:

I mean, I do think we're kind of that's a really good point and that's very valid, that's true. What about? When it comes to, like the other things that realtors are really good at, which is data collection and local specifics, right. A lot of sellers right now, a lot of homeowners are getting their they they're going to chat GPT to ask it how much is my home worth? What should I sell my house for, and you can ask it to give you comps.

Felicia:

You can say here's my address. How much do you think it's worth? Give me comparable properties and it will.

Declan:

they'll all be wrong but it can do it.

Felicia:

So until that is really cleaned up too, I mean I think we will get there right, like, at some point. It's got to be better than that because I've done the work. I actually did a presentation recently where I talked about AI versus a human and what the data collection says, and it was so incorrect. Their analysis on what the price should be and the comps that they use were completely inappropriate. And until appraisers are AI, I don't think we have to worry about realtors being AI, because that job is really I mean, that's really an in-person thing too. Right Is the appraisals. You've got to walk the property, you've got to measure it, you've got to see what the condition is. There's a lot of factors. There's a lot of issues with the way that appraisals are currently done that maybe AI could help out with. But yeah, I think you can't really rely on the data. So if you're a homeowner and you're using chat, gbt, it's probably wrong, just the same way Zillow is.

Declan:

And any other estimation. It's not going to be good. They're all wrong all the time. Yeah, yeah.

Felicia:

Even us. I mean, there's human error too, but Absolutely.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

We're a little better, I think, at still not only the creative side that you need for selling a home, but also the analysis side. That's really important.

Declan:

I'm watching the arc of it. I think the funniest. You know, the initial thing that happened once ChatGPT came along and people actively started using it. The place it showed up and it was bound to was in marketing text first, and it's gotten a lot better. But I had a good laugh in 2023. I had a good time just spotting.

Felicia:

Because you can always spot it, yeah, and people don don't prove it, nobody, I know that's the thing. It's so shocking to me. I'm like I I think the only way to go about the marketing like words is like you need to write it out yourself yeah and then just ask them to like clean it up or make it flow better, like don't ask them to write the whole thing for you, because it's not going to sound good.

Declan:

Well, you can do it the other way too. You can ask it for yeah, and then you edit it and make it more human, but it is.

Felicia:

It's not very human, it's a co-pilot kind of thing. Yeah, yeah.

Declan:

Yeah, it is, although it's getting better and better and better and better. Yes, and now we're getting into like now, when I talk to ChatGPT about what are you really useful for and where are the problems? Because this is again for anyone who's not using ChatGPT the greatest thing about it and the problem with it is that you go straight to it and ask it. You can literally ask it. You know how will you put me out of work and it will say I will happily put you out of work.

Declan:

All of work that's true, yeah. But when I talk to ChatGPT about who's most at risk in our industry, it seems that unfortunately over the last eight, nine years, maybe ten years, there's been an increasing reliance on virtual assistants Well, that seems to be, you know, their, their livelihoods are in jeopardy, because a lot of that work is the kind of work that AI will probably right. So, unfortunately, you know, that's where I would be looking first to see.

Felicia:

Yeah, or you know, I could see that um cause, we actually had this conversation recently with our amazing, beautiful, wonderful, smart and talented executive assistant, bianca. There you go. And you know she cause we're looking into all these platforms, these AI platforms, um, and I appreciated that. She said like well, what if this takes over my job?

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

Right, that's a fair question to ask your employers, like, if you guys are looking to invest in this, these platforms, what if that takes over my job? And I said, well, who do you think is going to learn this AI, bianca? Like we ain't doing it. Like I love this stuff, I would love to do that. It's not a good use of my time. Right, I have to be with the agents. I have to be with my clients.

Felicia:

I can't be, managing this AI bot. You need to. Somebody's got to oversee it right, and so maybe that I think you're right that that area, even for virtual assistants, is going to get minimized, but there will still be a need, I think, for somebody to manage it. So the people in those roles, I think it's very important that they get comfortable with AI. Just the same way we're asking Bianca to get comfortable with AI right, it's because she's probably going to be the one inputting it with AI. Right is because she's probably going to be the one inputting it.

Declan:

I don't want to be the one inputting it.

Felicia:

No, I know.

Declan:

But here's my concern, though when you think about it and I'll put in a little more scrutiny again and we look at, like, actually, where this is showing up, like in the white-collar workforce, people are now being asked at their corporate jobs like, first of all, they're being told you have to use AI, and then they're being asked and surveyed what are you using it for? And you can begin to see that what the employer is looking for is, like we want to get to the point that's so messed up.

Felicia:

Yeah, right.

Declan:

We want to get to the point where you train the AI right, Because it's all about training.

Felicia:

Right, so that it can then eventually replace you. Yes, I mean we do that with humans as well. Yes, right, like there's a lot of companies who will bring in a new person, you train them and then we'll let you go afterwards. Yes, right, without ever telling you that's what our plan is, that happens a lot.

Declan:

So to Bianca's point, though there will be a future point where something is trained in to take over, potentially, what she's doing, and then it'll become your choice as her employer to save a few dollars here for something that's faster and can work 24-7, or keep Bianca. You know these are the problems we're going to have to, you know, solve ethically, morally for ourselves.

Felicia:

And a lot of people, I think, who are, like, really in favor of ai taking over the world. They think that what's going to happen is it's going to free us up to live the lives that we should be living, so that we can take care of ourselves, we can be with our family, we can raise our children we can cook dinner, we can go to the gym, we can practice our hobbies right what they're not taking into account is the greed in America, and that, like it's just not.

Felicia:

It's already fallen apart and they're going to give us like ability to live just for living. You know, like they Right.

Declan:

And even a simpler question what if you just like making money? What if the there are people who just like they enjoy working hard and making money? What if the if there are people who just like they enjoy working hard and making?

Declan:

money, that's true, and and so, and they're, they feel their value in that sense because you have to have some meaning, and I'm not saying that, you know, just wanting to make money is a terribly meaningful thing, but there are people who actually enjoy working hard. And what if you? What if you take that away? You know, now somebody's like lost the ability to to give that kind of meaning to their lives.

Felicia:

You know, that's that's kind of a an interesting, uh concern, right so yeah, and how big is the divide really going to get between the wealthy and the unwealthy? Right like what is?

Declan:

I mean, it's already horrible, uh, you know, I mean there's, there's the, there's people who will casually, you know, tell you that there's no reason why a company like Google couldn't run with just a single person behind the wheel. You know, in the future. Well, like that should be possible. And you just think about yikes right, I mean you do.

Felicia:

You do still need some sort of human oversight as well. I can't tell you how many errors I've caught, and have you noticed that a lot. Chatgpt has a ton of the errors are out of control. Oh, totally. And there's also a bias that it has sometimes, Like I know now that my ChatGPT knows that I'm liberal and so it will answer things in a certain way and I'm like no, no, you're trying to make me more myself.

Felicia:

Sometimes you need to tell me what I don't want to hear, right? Yes, um, so I? I don't know that we're. I hope we're far away from everybody losing their jobs, um, but I think that the people who are embracing it and learning about it and doing what you're doing, like studying it and talking about and having these conversations will at least be better prepared to handle it when that time does come and I think there will be something else that we can do specifically in this industry, even if it doesn't look like what it looks like today.

Felicia:

So that's why I'm not as fearful, because I'll just shift into whatever else I need to work on.

Declan:

I will too.

Felicia:

I'll just become an AI bot. They're the only ones with jobs. I'll just be an AI bot.

Declan:

I'm not fearful at all. There's, you know, look at all the industry that got created around social media. You know we have a like you look at now versus even 10 years ago, there's more production, there's more people making more. I mean, there's plenty to do, you know, we'll always find something, yeah, but I'm interested. So, in terms of real estate, I think one of the places it's really going to show up you know, properly show up well, it's this predictive thing like this. You know. So, for people who farm, sure, yeah, I think for people who farm, it's going to put farming on some kind of steroids, because the platforms that I think are doing best in our industry and where agents might be able to get ahead is those people who like to farm. Now, you're, you know, if you're, if you couple that with ai predicting kind of.

Felicia:

So I have to save some of your time and yeah give you the answers to who is most likely to move in your farm, that's right so you can just target those folk and not waste your time door knocking on every single door. Just go to the ones that AI is telling you are most likely to move.

Declan:

That's right, so I picked out just three. There's one called likelyai, and their tagline is we predict people's next move before they know it. So that's one for farming solutions. It's likely seller leads, delivered by zip code. And then there's SmartZip, which is part of the Constellation real estate group, provides predictive analytics based on behavioral, financial and life event data.

Felicia:

Ooh life event data. Yes, oh, ai is predicting you're going to have a death in the family, right, all that stuff it's creepy, but it makes sense.

Declan:

Helps agents farm smarter by ranking homes by cell likelihood within a chosen territory Smart targeting. And then there's another one called Revaluate, and their tagline is we score people, not properties. Then there's another one called revaluate, and their tagline is we score people, not properties. So these are using ai to identify people, not just homes, who are about to move, often with surprising accuracy. That's you know according to them anyway, and taps into massive data sets of lifestyle changes job moves, marriages, divorces, kids, aging parents, etc. And it scores your existing contacts for likelihood to move.

Felicia:

Aging parents. How does it know that?

Declan:

Yeah, yeah.

Felicia:

Is it doing the math or is it looking up who your parents are?

Declan:

and Well, whatever, yeah, whatever it's tapping into Very interesting. But I think so, I think agents who are already you know, because oftentimes I don't know about you, but I see life as, like Some people are just born at the right time to be very, very compatible with a certain technology.

Felicia:

That is so true, or with whatever is the thing that's going on.

Declan:

Yes, you know, and it's just lucky Like you could have had somebody born 500 years ago who's like a shoo-in to be a super genius with AI.

Felicia:

Yeah, but unfortunately it was before yeah it came after their time.

Declan:

That's right, they had no interest in the printing press or whatever. It was right, yeah. So I think agents whose innate interest is already in farming I think those agents have a real advantage over agents who don't farm at all. That's true.

Felicia:

Or in those agents who have an interest or who are active users of AI. It's going to be easier for me, probably, to go and look at these platforms and decide which one I want and then to actually use it and use it in the way it's intended, and to benefit from it and grow my business and all of those things. If you're somewhat already familiar with how these things work, yes, exactly, that's just your timing.

Declan:

It's just perfect for something like that, because I don't farm at all. I don't farm at all either.

Felicia:

I have always said I want to Do. I really want to. If I'm not really doing it, maybe I don't, maybe I just think it's a good idea.

Declan:

You see, it's one of those. Let's be honest.

Felicia:

It's one of those realtor. Fomo things I mean, you know, we do have.

Felicia:

We do have an agent that is doing a great job hand delivering newsletters to her neighborhood yes and that's awesome, because she's like out walking with her kids and like dropping them off on doorsteps and talking to the neighbors, you know, and that's. I mean that face-to-face is really smart, so people get to know her and everything. Yeah, um, so I could foresee, if I could foresee. If you want to expand your farm, right, there's only so much time in the day to go and actually door knock. But if you want to take advantage of something like this and only hit the houses that you know are going to potentially come on the market at some point, that's a good use of your time.

Declan:

Like if I were getting into the business right now and I would absolutely be all over that. I would be all over that. I'd be like, okay, this is the direction we're going to go.

Felicia:

And if you stick with it long enough, just like anything in this business, I feel like a lot of the main ways to get business is just sticking with it long enough.

Declan:

Yeah, it is, it is like a time thing. Yeah, absolutely it is choosing time thing. Yeah, absolutely, it is choosing a thing.

Felicia:

Choose a thing and stick with it, and then it'll end up doing something. Yeah, yeah, it works. It all works, it's true. Just showing up every day Internet leads yeah, yeah, it all works. Neighbor events, social media yeah, social media, it all works.

Declan:

So you have to somewhat Drudgery.

Felicia:

Yeah.

Declan:

That's the thing, right, but I I'm going to look into these that you listed.

Felicia:

You know I've mostly only been using AI for like personal business, like organization yes, not necessarily like generating. I haven't done any AI generated stuff, like one of my best friends recently introduced me to an AI email platform that has absolutely changed my ability to respond and to clean up my inbox. It's called superhuman.

Declan:

Okay, have you heard of this.

Felicia:

No, I want to know all your texts. I love it, so I, we, we are big Google users. I use like Google. Um, we have a Google office space, so we use Google chat. We use Google Google. The only we don't use the Google video. Okay, the Google meets. We use zoom. I prefer zoom. Um but there is. You can link your Gmail or whatever to superhuman and it takes over your inbox. So it takes over your email. It has a way. Cleaner user face.

Felicia:

So, it's more simple. It's not crowded with a bunch of other stuff. You can set up filters very easily. So it knows like hey, these are emails that you rarely ever open. Let me go put it over here in this like other folder Right, and there's also an AI integrated part of it, where when you're composing an email, there's AI built into it, so you don't have to go to chat GPT and ask hey, I'm writing this email, here's what they said. Write a response.

Declan:

Right.

Felicia:

It's just built into the app. Right Um and so, and it's way better than chat GPT Like it sounds more professional sounds more like me. It sounds more like it's learning because it can read all my emails, like it has all my emails. It knows how I've responded to this in the past. It's really good at creating templates for emails. So if there's something that you say over and over again which we do a lot like, say in an email, you're explaining how an appraisal works right.

Felicia:

Now I just hit a certain button and it's linked to what I usually say, and so it'll just automatically input that section into my email. Saves me a ton of time from going back. Have you done this where you go through your old emails Like you're looking for, like oh, I sent that really good email that one time and like I just want to copy and paste that to this other client?

Declan:

That's right.

Felicia:

This is a shortcut, so if you know you wrote out a really good email. You're like let me just save this as like a little template, Um, and it's just a really smart. It took me a few days to get used to it, but, honestly, after a week I was like pretty sold on it already. Wow, Okay.

Declan:

Well, tell me more about your tech stack. What else are you using?

Felicia:

Well, when it comes to AI, I'm pretty limited. It's ChatGPT and SuperHuman. Those are my two AI things I'm taking it slow, but you know, in Chat GPT you can create all of these GPTs. I don't know if have you played around with that yet.

Declan:

Yes.

Felicia:

So we had an appraiser come to our weekly brokerage meeting. Talk about appraisals.

Declan:

Yeah.

Felicia:

And he built a GPT for appraisals. He uploaded all the appraisal guidelines and laws so that anytime we have a question about, like you know, let's say, oh, this room like things that we have where it's like, oh, this room has a low ceiling. Will this be included in the square footage?

Declan:

Yes.

Felicia:

You can ask that GPT the question and it has all the laws, so it knows what can count and what can't count. Yes, and so we don't have to go to our local appraiser and ask you know, and bug them while they're out being busy. We just have this AI platform that can answer those questions for our agents. So he shared that with us and I was like, oh my gosh, this is brilliant.

Declan:

We should be doing this with a lot of different things yeah, no, this is actually brilliant, and it barely gets spoken about right there. So I love you bringing this up because I have played around with this as well and it's amazing.

Felicia:

Yeah, because you've done it before where you've uploaded a document, right, and you're like, hey, can you find the section that has this, or whatever. Yes, if there's a permanent document that you keep going back to just make a GPT for it. So I'm actually going to do this with all of our MLS rules because we are in three different MLSs and so it's hard for me to remember my rule versus the other rule of the other MLS right.

Felicia:

So I'm going to upload all of them and then I can just ask hey, for Solano County, what is the rule on days on market for refreshing it right, or whatever, and so-.

Declan:

And so, for people listening, if you don't know what a GPT is, this is the beauty of ChatGPT and AI Ask ChatGPT what a GPT is and you can.

Felicia:

Basically, it's gonna tell you, yeah, and you can even ask it for ideas Like what kind of GPTs should I? Yes, you've read my, you know my past conversations with you.

Declan:

Right, like what, what kind of things do you think could help me in my real estate business? What kind of gpt should I create? Yes, um love that. Yeah, creating gpts is really smart people doing in families now for various things, um, with their family, trees and history and all that stuff.

Felicia:

So, yeah, yeah I like the personal ways that you can use chat gpt too. Yeah, yeah, yeah, um, it's great. Like, I use it for like, um reading ingredients, like on a certain product, right, if I'm trying to avoid something for my acne prone skin, I'll ask it like hey, does this have any core poor clogging ingredients?

Declan:

Okay, right, right Cause.

Felicia:

I don't want to sit there and research every single ingredient. That's in something Right, so it's brilliant. But in terms of our other tech stack stuff, we're big on Google Zoom, Canva. Our entire brokerage is run through Notion, Don't know. And there's AI built into Notion too. I didn't even think of that. Notion is a platform where we can store different resources for our agents for them to easily be able to access them again.

Felicia:

So that's where all of our recordings to our trainings are, all of our recordings to our weekly meetings, um, we have in there, like um, a template for hey, here's all. When you have a listing here's a checklist. Okay, right, so it can serve as, like a task manager slash random place to store notes. Yeah, um.

Felicia:

But the cool thing about it, too, is that you can turn any of your internal pages into website pages oh wow and so I will sometimes like for a client if I'm like, let's say, I'm managing a project for a client yeah I will what you're not supposed to do as an agent, don't. You're not a contractor, but I will like keep notes in there and then just share it to them as a website. And so they can see all of my internal notes just as a website.

Felicia:

Oh, I like that, and so it's kind of an easy way to make a simple website too. Yeah, and it has AI built into it too, but we don't use that feature as much. But, yeah, that's where you know. We're very grateful to have Bianca become an expert in that platform so that way she can keep us organized.

Felicia:

Because, how many times is it that you're like I send something really cool to somebody right and like this is a great resource that I want all the agents to have. But where do we store it, right, like where? Where do we put? Do we just put it in a google folder and then you have to like search for it. It's hard to find, um. So it's better to have a platform where the search bar can easily like if you're like trying to find something, it can easily search for it and find it yes um.

Declan:

So yeah, we love, we love notion oh, I, yeah, okay, I'm going to make a note of that and look into it. So I want to wrap things up a little, because you've been great and it's been great. Oh, I did want to tell you one thing I use ChatGPT for a lot.

Felicia:

Yes, please.

Declan:

And one of the reasons I kept running out of memory because I take photographs a lot of things- Okay, and lot of things okay and I'll be like this is broken, fix it it. Like I think youtube um, you know, instructional videos, those are gonna, those are gonna go, because basically I have chat gpt now and I'll be like doing a small project. Let's say I was putting in a nest.

Declan:

I was putting in a nest thermostat in the house a couple of weeks ago and I open up the current thermostat. I'm like here's what I'm looking at, how do I make this Nest? I could take a picture of the Nest, take a picture of my thermostat and it says oh, you need to do this, this and this.

Felicia:

Yeah, because it knows which one it is, and then you can ask it questions too. You can say, like I did that and it didn't work, what else can I try, and then it'll give you another idea. Yeah, exactly, it's brilliant use of chat gp. I love that. I use that same strategy, but for tech assistance. Yes, I use that a lot for, like you know, I'm in my crm and I'm like, um god, I don't remember how to do the one thing that I learned on that one webinar or whatever it was. So you can just ask. It literally knows everything about every platform. Yes, because it can read its instructional thing online. Like it knows everything. Yes, so yeah.

Declan:

I mean, sometimes I'll get up in the morning and say I don't like watching the news and I just want to get condensed versions of the news that's relevant to me. So in the morning I'll ask ChatGPT what happened in the morning. I'll ask ChatGPT what happened in the last 12 hours? That's a great consequence in the world and I should be aware of. And I'll say here's three things Okay, thanks. And then I can get on with my day. I love that, and I'll know whether or not there was another bombing and some god-awful thing happened or whatever.

Felicia:

But I'll know just real quick so I can kind of just get on with my day, not just emotionally get bogged down and all that stuff. Okay, and that just reminded me of something. So I recently got downloaded this program called Speechify and it will turn any text into like a podcast. Like for me, I love listening to podcasts.

Felicia:

I love like sound, and just you know cause I could be doing something else with my hands or whatever. So if there's something you're trying to learn about, you can get this speechify and it's just like an extension on your browser. And so if I'm in like, let's say, an article or a chat, GPT. I can just click on that button and it'll read it to me in the voice that I have selected and the speed that I want.

Declan:

Oh, I like that.

Felicia:

You might like that for learning how to do certain things, or like if you're, if there's just something you're learning about right, like, and you just want to, yes, like hear about it instead of reading it. Yes, it's a great okay, speechify a notion.

Declan:

I'm getting some good stuff from you today. This is really really cool. Yeah, um, I okay. I do want to talk a little bit about the market, though, because I always try and oh, that'll market.

Felicia:

Yeah, a little bit back to the market.

Declan:

The market, you know. We won't worry about interest rates. They're not going anywhere. Even yesterday somebody was saying to me you know, in September we're going to see better rates.

Felicia:

I don't know. I'm not even talking about that anymore. Yeah.

Declan:

Because the last time that Jerome Powell, when they cut rates by half point after many, many years, mortgage rates went up.

Felicia:

Yeah.

Declan:

And it stunned everybody. And so you tell me that the Fed might cut rates in September.

Felicia:

That's the thing it's like, please don't post on social media that you think that the rates are going to do something, because they probably won't Like that's the thing it's like. Remember there was so much when that happened before that happened. There was so much content coming out, every realtor was making a video about how rates are about to drop, and then it didn't happen.

Declan:

So I gave up, I gave up. I said I'm never playing this game again.

Felicia:

No, it's ridiculous.

Declan:

Yeah, the, the. They cut the short term fed funds rate and mortgage rates went up the next day. It was like what the heck is going on. So, so anyway, um, but the market is interesting.

Felicia:

Yes, yes, and it's interesting for us too, because we're in so many different markets.

Declan:

Yes.

Felicia:

So what we're seeing is a lot of times things happen in auxiliary markets right, and then it transfers over to the neighboring market.

Declan:

Yes.

Felicia:

So it's important to kind of keep your finger on what else is happening in other places in California, yes, or even in the country, or even just in the East Bay. Yeah even just in the neighboring city, Like something that impacts like Berkeley. How is that going to impact Oakland?

Declan:

Are more people going to?

Felicia:

start choosing Oakland over Berkeley. So it's very interesting to watch what's happening in Solano County, where a lot of our agents are located, because it's struggling. It's definitely turned into a buyer's market. We have a lot of agents who are very listing heavy and their listings are sitting and the days on market is longer and we're having a lot of conversations around. How do we have these hard, difficult conversations with our sellers? What tools can we use to help in that kind of data analysis? We just purchased for our brokerage something called List Track. You might want to look into this as well. It's a very simple platform. If you're somebody who gets overwhelmed by platforms, this is a very easy tool to use. It's very basic. But what it does is it looks at all of the data that that listing has experienced. How many views did it get on Zillow? How many views did it get on Redfin? How many views on the MLS? How many from broker-run sites?

Declan:

right.

Felicia:

Because all of the brokerages have sites that pour from the MLS it tracks all of that. It tracks how many saves it got. It tracks like how, um, just a ton of different. Like you know how how well is this listing doing compared to other listings in this area? You can also put it like in different terms of like. Let's only look at the data from the last seven days right now, what did it do over the last 30 days?

Felicia:

right, and which is important, once we're seeing these longer days on market, it's important to know how did we do when we first hit the market versus how are we doing now. Are things turning around? And for some of our listings that has been the case where it's been on the market for longer and all of a sudden in the last seven days, something has shifted in buyer perception, where now we're getting a lot more views Like what was it?

Felicia:

Or you know, we always make those little tweaks where it's like let's change the photos around or like yes, let's drop the price right, we want to see what did that price reduction actually do for our client right that is where you can get that data? Um, because you can see, once we did that price reduction, the views shot up on friday, okay, and then they started decreasing again come monday right so it's important to kind of.

Felicia:

It shows you which day of the week. It also shows you what location those buyers are in. Who is viewing from where, so you can know are my buyers moving here from San Francisco? Where is this all coming from? So it's helpful to track all of that kind of information.

Declan:

Okay, let's track. Great, I've got some amazing things from you. Thanks, I try. Yeah, that's really really helpful yeah. That's really really helpful. So Solano County kind of struggling, it's struggling yeah, and then you do a lot more.

Felicia:

It's a buyer's market. I mean, I'm conflating the fact that you live in Martinez with maybe thinking you're doing Well, I tell everybody, I cover Alameda and Contra Costa County, yeah, and so that's interesting too, because those are very different markets. Things are, you know, you can negotiate differently in some of those cities than you can in the ones that we're used to like in Oakland and Berkeley. Right, but it's like any market where the combination of updates and list price is what's going to get it done, right.

Felicia:

So it's just about prepping the seller for that prior to coming on the market, having those difficult conversations up front so that they feel prepared that it's going to. Such a thing is even achievable.

Declan:

I mean, I know you love to work.

Felicia:

I am a worker.

Declan:

You know yeah.

Felicia:

But I have been very intentional over the last like I will say maybe two years on carving out time. I have to force it. It's not a natural thing for me to take time off. I'm one of those people who, if I sit for too long, I start like saying bad things about myself, like I'm lazy or I'm not trying hard enough or you know. So that's not good. We don't want that negative self-talk.

Felicia:

if you're resting, we want you to appreciate the rest that you're getting and the downtime that you're getting. That's very smart, by the way, but it's hard. If that's not your natural way right, you kind of have to work at it. So it's something I've been working on, um, and you know my, my secret that really worked for me was I have to sign up for something that is a commitment that's going to take me out of my business, and for me that's been pottery. So my husband, my sweet darling husband, purchased a gift card for me, I think for my birthday.

Felicia:

A couple of years, darling husband purchased a gift card for me, I think, for my birthday a couple of years a year and a half ago or something, and I um for taking a pottery class, a wheel throwing class, something I've always wanted to do, would never spend the money or take the time out of my schedule to do that.

Declan:

I would never sign up for that, because that's just a commitment, you know, and this is a longterm skill.

Felicia:

It takes years to learn. So, um, now I have my class. It's three hours once a week, and it's time that I literally can't touch my phone because my hands are covered in mud and you know, it's just, it's. I have to be in that focus zone and it's something that distracts your brain enough to where you don't think about all the things going on at work.

Felicia:

Sometimes it bleeds through, cause I'm human and I'm not great at meditating, but that's my trick. It needs to be something expensive so that I actually show up to it, and it needs to be something that distracts me enough to where I can't look at my phone or check my emails or answer calls.

Declan:

So this is what I get from that, though, too as well. Is that downtime for you, or like it's still active time it's active?

Felicia:

Yeah, for me, because I need to be active, right Like I don't do well if I'm sitting too long.

Declan:

Right If.

Felicia:

I'm. I'm trying to rest, sometimes a little bit more. Now, too, I'm getting better at like it's okay to lay on the couch sometimes. Yes, it's not the end of the world If you watch a reality TV show cause I love reality TV. I do, trust me, I do, but it takes a lot of time to watch these shows, right? So yeah for me the the. I get a lot more rest from still being somewhat active.

Declan:

Right, yeah, but downtime it needs to be, it's an activity yeah.

Felicia:

You gotta, you gotta have something. You I mean, yeah, if you're, if you really want to do downtime without an activity, you could just literally sit there and stare at a wall. That's another option, you, you can't people do that? You could learn how to meditate. Yeah, it's really hard for me, though, to yeah.

Declan:

I need something to keep my brain busy yeah, no, meditation is a whole, a whole separate thing. I don't think it's nearly as simple as other activities that engage your mind. So we have one agent who Disengaging your mind is a lot more difficult than engaging your mind in an activity that's not work.

Felicia:

Yeah, or like Dominic does bocce. Okay, I don't know if he's shared much about that, but he does bocce every Tuesday night.

Declan:

You know what? Dominic is just an old Italian man.

Felicia:

He really is, isn't he cute? He really is. I'm like aren't you a little young for bocce? Yes, he does it with actually some of our past clients that are some of our now our closest friends and they play bocce together. I don't join because the team is full, but also it's hard, for the team is full but also, like I, just it's hard for me to commit to something every Tuesday night. You know like. You know how it is, you gotta keep your schedule a little bit flexible.

Felicia:

Um so, and one of our I was going to say one of our agents, she plays Mahjong every. Tuesday Um, that's her thing. You know, like you gotta, you find something that is outside of work that you enjoy, and it's really sad that I think our culture has gone so far away from this of finding something that brings you happiness just for the sake of it bringing you happiness. It doesn't need to do anything else, it just needs to bring you a little bit of joy. But it's hard for people to find something, I think.

Declan:

Yeah, hopefully it's not, though Hopefully they can as they get older. Hopefully you find something, I think. Yeah, yeah, you know, hopefully it's not, though hopefully they they can hopefully you find something yeah, I mean, I think being physically healthy is a bet, is a is a bonus. You're more likely to find something if you're well.

Felicia:

So just taking care of yourself is a good start in my opinion yeah and then you know, and then you'll you know that's another expensive thing that I was like this is worth paying for. You know, I have a trainer that.

Declan:

I see once a week Okay.

Felicia:

You know, every Thursday. Yes, I'm like okay, I got to you know, and I miss them. Sometimes I do, I do. I miss a lot of sessions.

Declan:

How do you know when? Because I like to work and you like to work, you enjoy working right, there's a certain amount of work that you just want to do because it's a happy place. But how do you know when you've just hit your limit and it's time to pull back? I don't, and that's the problem.

Felicia:

Dominic is very good at recognizing it in me.

Declan:

Oh, okay.

Felicia:

And that's helpful. So having a partner who knows that this is an ongoing issue, that you don't know how to turn off.

Felicia:

Um, and it's even harder when you're a person who, um, other people rely on right, like, not only clients. You know how it is when a client calls you answer at night. You know sometimes, um, when you have agents that rely on you and they're going through something in their transaction and they need you right away, I'm going to answer like I'm, I'm, I'm going to be responsive and that's just like what you have to do sometimes. But Dominic will recognize when it's bleeding too far into personal life or you know my.

Felicia:

I've been working since early in the morning, and now it's past dinner time and you're still in front of your computer. Right and you're still in front of your computer. So he will come and he'll sometimes send me a text with a warning Like you've got 20 minutes, and then he'll come into my physical space and tap me. Sometimes I need a physical, I need somebody to literally pull me away.

Declan:

You need a cue.

Felicia:

Yeah, I need a cue, and so I haven't set that up for myself. But luckily he recognizes that. That's beautiful, he does that for me and I really appreciate that that he does that for me and I really appreciate that.

Declan:

Yeah, that's really really nice. He calls it getting stuck. Yeah, yeah, he's like you're stuck, felicia, I can't keep you anymore, but it's been an absolute pleasure. I can't wait to listen to this podcast myself because you brought up so many great things, and I'm going to literally sit down myself and like take some notes.

Felicia:

I hope it's been useful to everyone who listened and, uh, you could probably just upload it to chat GPT and have them take notes for you.

Declan:

Well you know, yes, I probably like listening to.

Felicia:

I do like listening Well thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it so much. It's such an honor to speak with you every time and you're such a good conversationalist, so I appreciate it.

Declan:

Well, we'll have you back Next time when I go to video.

Felicia:

Oh yeah, yes, and then I can make funny faces at the camera. Yeah, that sounds great. We're going to do it. We're going to do that in 2026. Awesome.

Declan:

And so, in fact, let's make you the first guest. So now I have a goal.

Felicia:

There you go, you'll be my first on-screen guest. I'll bother you about it, yeah.

Declan:

We'll get day and we'll talk to you on video next time, all right, ciao, yeah, this episode of the podcast was edited by me, with original music by Chuck Lindo and graphics by Lisa Mazur. The podcast is brought to you by the Home Factor Realtors, thehomefactorcom. Catch up on the latest news from the East Bay Market in their weekly sub stack published every Saturday. Go to thehomefactorcom to subscribe Now. If you'd like to reach out to me with suggestions for the show, that kind of thing, please text me at 415-446-8591. Catch you on the next podcast, everybody. Thank you for listening.